I know Bulova wasn’t the only company to put some variation of Hudson Maxim’s name on a watch so I figured, what the hell, let’s see what the panel has to say. This watch belongs to a friend. He supplied the pictures.
The movement was made by Racine Freres. The only marks on the case appear to say GERBER SWISS.
Initially, I told him it doesn’t have the hallmarks of a Bulova. But I don’t know about the very early days and how Bulova did things. He found some reference in a form saying Bulova used Racine Freres movements in the earliest watches.
If this flat out isn’t an early Bulova in any way, please remove it from the database. It sure would be cool if it was though.
In reply to A quick search reveal that… by mart1n888
curiously i can see the Wadsworth case and the Star watch case company who is at an adress who tell me something......
In reply to curiously i can see the… by mart1n888
look my previous comment on the end of page 2.
In reply to A quick search reveal that… by mart1n888
i'll comment on the 'freres' part.
Freres is French for Brothers, so Your findings are correct in that aspect.
Racine Brothers
In reply to A quick search reveal that… by mart1n888
If you are saying that 'Racine Freres' did not exist until 1918, then that is confirmation that this watch cannot predate 1918 and as such we probably have the date correct.
is someone read the last comment on page 2 ?.
At this early timeframe Bulova were known to use other manufactures cases as they were not producing some case styles and sizes.
I doubt we'll ever be able to 100% confirm what case manufactures Bulova were using in the 'very early' days.
I have checked with another collector who specialises in these early watches (he probaby has the best collection in existance of very early mens Bulova watches), and he cannot rule out Bulova did not use this manufacture.
In reply to At this early timeframe… by mybulova_admin
of course i know bulova probably use other mfg case for his assembly, but did the other collector can confirm this case was use by bulova? if not , only a dial cant make it a bulova. The probleme is we have to prove that case was used by bulova cause as we know in 1918 bulova already use his own case (american standard) and in 1915 too by your american maid..... and 1916 we see rubaiyat trench watch case...... why using a unknown case name with maxim hudson dial. and moreover like as i say in the last comment on page 2, the RACINE movement is from enicar who as put the lady racine serie and enicar serie till 1914 on market.... but the most important thing is if we date and id by the case..... where is the proof that case is a or used by bulova ? whitout this proof ..... once again.... only a dial cant make it a bulova for sure..... missing info on the case. can we link it to bulova by a way or another ? so if we go this way, a ton of old watch can be a bulova..... just like one i found with a star watch case or wadswort case with movement from cattin-aubry or A. RACINE (before 1918) can all be from bulova..... do we will accept to id these watch as a bulova ? for the gerber case company we need a solid link. cause other way you will have to accept these(wadsworth and star watch) watch too. as i told in my long comment on page 2. no reference for gerber case but look at this picture from here what we can see at the bottom is the swc co and wadsworth case co. i have a link for this too and do we accept to put in the data base ? sadly no! so why do we accept the subject watch? for the dial? as i told, im in search of consistency fir this hm./sites/default/files/uploaded_photos/user24327/Screenshot_20240908_102328_com.android.chrome.jpg
this is a link to prove star watch case and wadsworth case was use in 1915 and before...... and we dont put it on site ? but this hm can sit in d.b.? really hard too understand.
In reply to of course i know bulova… by mart1n888
so, let me introduce you the first bulova 1914 in d.b. !
/sites/default/files/uploaded_photos/user24327/Screenshot_20241002_070818.jpg
/sites/default/files/uploaded_photos/user24327/Screenshot_20241002_070211.jpg
/sites/default/files/uploaded_photos/user24327/Screenshot_20241002_070157.jpg
now if we keep this hm without consistency proof we can surely take these pictures i show you and tell its a bulova 1914! and i have a reference link...... more consistency!
now waiting what you think about all of this......
i will very very happy if we can confirm for Gerber case cause it will land on my bucket list for sure!
always in search of info for this case "Gerber".
In reply to so, let me introduce you the… by mart1n888
Unfortunately there is nothing in any of the 3 photos to suggest that Bulova had anything to do with that watch. Does it resemble a Bulova watch? Yes. Many of the watches from ths period looked very similar as they used 'parts' from a small group of manufactures (case and movement), from both US and Swiss based companies.
It's well known that the first ladies pendant watches or 'wristlets' came out around 1913. Bulova may or may not have been 'selling' watches at this time, but they were certainly not (to the best of our knowledge) selling watches branded Bulova at this time.
When it comes to cases, it is my opinion that Bulova simply used other companies along with their own to case their movements. As per my previous comment this may have been due to the variety of case styles, gold v gold filled, sizes and numbers availabe to fulfil orders. You have shown that a good number of case manufactures all operated out of 15 Maiden Lane, including Wadsworth, Star and Keystone. So I imagine it would have been very easy for someone at J Bulova Co, to walk up the street and place an order for 100 size 9 plain round gold filled cases, or 50 size 10 cushion engraved gold filled cases.
Very little online in reguards to GERBER.
Trying desperately to not go down this rabbit hole but is GERBER a case manufacturer or a case quality type?
Mikrolisk has nothing and if they were a manufacturer surely there would be something out there.