Black luminescent dial 1940's President

Submitted by plainsmen on

I've seen a couple of these in the last 10 years but I've always thought it was a redial.  It appears to be a black luminescent dialed President from say the early 1940's.   Almost like a "General", but with a yellow gold case and black dial vs the rose gold/copper.

Black dial Lumi President

What I think is happening, is a movement/dial swap from the 1946 Bulova Ambassador that we see in this advertisement from 1946.  The movement/dials should be interchanglable in the 7A* series if I recall.  Thoughts?

1946 Bulova Ambassador Advertisement

mybulova_admin
Posted November 24, 2024 - 8:11pm

It's possible. When you think about it, a watch with a lume numbers dial should also have lumed/radium hands.

Bulova watch hands

Any notch on the dial to indicate a redial?

FifthAvenueRes…
Posted November 25, 2024 - 5:35am

The dial of the subject is not a match to the 'AMBASSADOR' 

If I recall the 'AMBASSADOR' numerals are raised Silver, not Radium. 

FifthAvenueRes…
Posted November 25, 2024 - 6:28am

In reply to by FifthAvenueRes…

For certain the Gilt Index style hands do not belong on the Radium dial. 

FifthAvenueRes…
Posted November 26, 2024 - 3:33am

'47 'AMBASSADOR' "C" has the raised Silver numeral Dial.

plainsmen
Posted November 26, 2024 - 4:56am

In reply to by FifthAvenueRes…

The ad states luminescent.  I've seen hundreds of this dial with applied numbers.  Not as described.

FifthAvenueRes…
Posted November 27, 2024 - 6:27am

A poor choice of words or typographical error on the 1946  'AMBASSADOR' ad,  obviously the numerals are not Radium. 

JEV1A
Posted December 10, 2024 - 7:50am

A historical lesson about Radium Hands and Dials. Post WWI and the late 1920's - 1930's US Radium Corp, Orange, NJ had mainly women painting watch dials and hands for military use. They are known as the Radium Girls. They all died of horrific Bone disease caused by saliva and powdered and liquid radium mixing together. After the deaths, the 1930 Factory Workers Protection Act was passed. By 1940, Radium is this form was no longer used for commercial use within the timepiece industry. A enamel based harmless luminous paint was now is use.  That is what you will see on most post 1940's dial and hands.  John V.  TIME & AGAIN 

FifthAvenueRes…
Posted December 11, 2024 - 9:19am

In reply to by JEV1A

I'm not so sure about the post 1940's use of Radium John. 

Many parts packages (of hands) are marked RD (Radium) through the 40's and into the 1950's, particularly the Military stuff. 

 mid - late 1950's is the earliest date I see Luminous parts referred to as 'Lume' not Radium. 

 

JimDon5822
Posted December 10, 2024 - 8:49pm

I believe there are two documented ads for the General.   Yellow gold with white lumed dial and hands and Rose gold with copper lumed dial and hands.  It is possible there was a black dial version but I have not seen any ads and the hands are not lumed so either the hands or the dial color are incorrect.  

mybulova_admin
Posted December 11, 2024 - 2:56am

Good point. A General would make more sense, especially with a luned dial and hands.