American Standard Cases Revisited c1919 through c1924 & later

Too many questions for one thread.  Could the 'Shield' indicate a Case manufacured in the United States and the 'Globe' indicate a Case manufactured elsewhere or manufactured for International use.  The Shield is most definately a United States reference and the Globe is, well it's a Globe - not hard to figure out. The Shield could be an indicator of a Watch Cased in the United States and the Globe an indicator of a Watch cased elsewhere. eg: Switzerland?  Issue Dates of these 2 American Standard trademarks will hold clues, possibly answers.  'Old Glory'  'The Great Seal of the United States' ca 1913.

edit: The Shield and the Globe may have to do with proper Taxation / Tariffs.

"The American Standard Watch Case Company was founded in 1920 and formerly located on Sprague Street. The building at 425 Dexter Street was constructed in 1942-43. A newspaper article reported that American Standard Watch Case Company led the trade in the late 1920s. The building was modernized in 1945 with an addition to accommodate a cafeteria for the company’s 850 employees. The company was bought by watch giant Bulova in 1948 (RIHPHC 1979, 1981; Woodward 1986)"  XXX Broken Link Removed XXX-admin  

American Standard Watch Cases will not pre-date 1920.

Interestingly, I see Bulova owns the trademark for "American Standard", and the "American Standard Shield Design", Biel and New York, 1918. Did Bulova partly own the American Standard Case Co?

Reverand,  I'd have to say Yes.

Written History tells Us Joseph Bulova (then doing buisness as J. Bulova Co.) owned a Watch manufacturing facility in Bienne (Biel) Switzerland.  Much of the published  information on the  purchase or sale of Companies could be accredited to things changing hands 'on paper', as is often done in the Corporate World. American Standards' formation in 1920 could be accredited to Joseph Bulova and His master plan to produce (Case and Time) Watches in the United States. If J. Bulova Co. owned the American Standard trademark I would say this is a definate.

I did see Bulova had the trademark for "American Standard" as seen below:

And also found a few more details on this particular trademark registration:

With the following description of the filing above, click for webpage displaying full record:


If Bulova claims used since 1 August 1918, does this fit w/ the beginning date of 1920 for American Standard Watch Case Co.?   Sure is a long time between Bulova first using "American Standard" (1918), filing for trademark for  "American Standard" (1927), and then eventually purchasing American Standard in 1948. 

I also see Bulova trademarked the "arching" MONOGRAM, which is seen in this  1925 unknown  American Standard case (which has a case serial number starting with "1").

What I didn't see was a trademark for the American Standard "Shield Design" Rev Rob mentions above.  Rob- was this Shield Design trademarked first used in 1918 or filed in 1918?

In a post by OldTicker, he scanned in some pages with trademarks, one of which was referenced as "American Standard trademarks" containing this snippet below.  Not seeing American Standard, but seeing several close names and a shield symbol (and MONOGRAM?):

A little further up in OT's post, there's a Bulova Trademarks page, containing this snippet below, which looks like a "globe" on the right, but other than appearance, not sure if it has any relation to the American Standard "Globe" symbol.  I didn't see a filing or first use date for the Bulova snippet below.

I'm wondering if we can say something about the date of the cases based on the "Globe" vs. "Shield" and use this to check how well the first digit of case serial numbers fit movement production year (since we are using first digit of case serial number to date some of these early movements).  If American Standard was making cases for other watch manufacturers in 1921-1923 AND not yet wholly owned by Bulova, would the first digit of the case serial numbers necessarily follow the patterns seen for first digit as year of production?   
I'm looking for a way to "set the clock", so to speak.

The Egg.  Not to veer off course but I want to get this in. American Watch Case Company. "Surviving from their inception in 1893 until 1939, the American Watch Case Company was based in Manhattan, New York,  and specialised in the manufacture of fine-quality gold pocket watch cases".  The image above appears on page 111 of a Jewelers trade book (unknown title) Dated 1904. The upper highlighted area indicates American Watch Case Co's address as 13 Maiden Lane, New York - The premesis of Joseph Bulova while doing buisness as J. Bulova Co. Of other interest is a secondary address in Toronto Canada, another known location of Bulova Watch Co. manufacturing.

Looks like ol' Joseph had his fingers in many pies from an early date, hmm?

Yes, oddly enough I just read of an old lathe found which belonged to American Watch Case Co - the lathe was built by Ardee manufacturing of Ohio.

I'd seen "American Watch Case Co." but didn't put the addresses together with Bulova.  Indeed interesting. Also found another horological trademark index here: http://www.mikrolisk.de/show.php?site=280&suchwort=Bulova&searchWhere=all#sucheMarker 
They list "American Standard Shield Design" and "American Standard", unfortunately with no date or graphics associated with the shield design entry.
 American Standard  Bulova Watch Co. Inc.

Kleinuhren; Biel, Schweiz; New York, USA; registriert am 1.8.1918

American Standard Shield Design

Bulova Watch Company, Inc. / J. Bulova & Cie.

Biel, La Chaux-de-Fonds, Schweiz; New York, USA

I'm noting that American Watch Case Co is referred to as manufacturing "Pocket Watch Cases"  Joseph Bulovas' first fully Jeweled Gent's Wristwatch was manufactured in 1919+/-, according to historical records.  Back to the original notion:  Are We correct to Date the older Bulova pieces Cased in American Standard by seriel number as established 1924 - 1949.  If Bulova owned the Case Company why not?  We're close, very close and the definative answer is before Us, somewhere.

Scratch the original notion for dating American Standard Hallmarked Cases (and the Movements they contain) as these Cases do not follow the trend of Bulova Watch Cases manufactured 1924 thru 1949.  The Watch below is branded 'Rubaiyat' on the Dial. The Caseback is hallmarked American Standard with the Globe below. Warranted 20 Years. The Case Serial number is 100885. The Movement inside is signed Bulova W. Co Swiss and is absent of any Model identication on its Bridge as recently exampled in better detail here http://www.mybulova.com/node/4997

The most informative information is found on the outer Caseback.  Inscribed 12 - 25 -19

--> Content removed due to mis-use of images. ADMIN

Totally screws the case SN dating then. Is this your watch, Mark?

For the Dating of pre 1924 Cases bobbee, Yes it does.

The Watch is not in My personal collection and has not entered the Model database for identification.

Really good looking, and excellent condition. Gold fill looks nice, not bad for 20 year guaranteed!

Good to have in DB anyway.

Correction: I made a previous statement indicating Joseph Bulovas' original address in NYC as 13 Maiden Ln, that is incorrect. Joseph Bulovas' address was 57 Maiden Ln. which is not the same location as American Watch Case Co. at 13 Maiden Ln. The article above was published in the New York Times - May 4, 1895. http://query.nytimes.com/gst/abstract.html?res=FB0C14FF3B5D15738DDDAD08… there is no mention of Watchmaking, Watch Cases or Watches in the article. Joseph Bulovas' occupation is listed as Jeweler, trade as Jewelery.

gotta love the internet.

Could 57 Maiden Ln have been his residence? The article doesn't specify but I would think that they would mention a juror's home address rather than their business address.

That sounds right to me. He was originally listed as a jeweller, and in 1920, they moved to 5th Ave. The wristwatch was a new phenomenon, and Bulova seems to have been on board along with a few other companies to recognize its significance early on. 

Darren,  The clues are there.  Most written History denotes Joseph Bulovas' first location as a 'small premesis' on Maiden Lane and from what I have researched 13 Maiden Lane was a 'large glass superstructure of several floors' with 3 addresses 9,11 and 13 Maiden Lane.

Below is Artist John Mackie Falconers' rendition of what was 55-59 Maiden Ln. New York. The rectangular sign which is centrally located in the image next to the Road states '59 Toys', a Toy shop which would make 55-57 Maiden Lane on the left the property of J. Rucklass -Tailor.  The painting is Dated 1851    The locale is at the Corner of Maiden Lane and Williams St. where the Federal Reserve building now stands.

The origins of Maiden Lane.  "Where Maiden Lane is there was once a narrow stream or spring water, which flowed from about the present Nassau Street. Women went there to wash their clothing, so that it came to be called the Virgin's Path, and from that the Maiden's Lane."  above excerpt from the book: Nooks and Corners of Old New York by Charles Hemstreet.

I'm thinking:   American Standard Watch Case Co. only made cases for Bulova.  They were a wholly owned subsidiary of J Bulova Co. from c1918 onward.  The examples we see with other company movements in Am Std cases are either "subsidiary companies" owned by J Bulova  (e.g. Rubaiyat W Co), or marriages from early movement swaps.  The Am Std cases which are signed 19K 1/12 rolled gold plate were possibly for foreign markets. 
We see various groupings of the following case markings:
-American Standard
-Bulova Quality
-Bulova
-Monogram
-Monogram Quality
-The "shield"
-The "globe"
-various metal content marks
-some patent dates for dust-tight technology (or what ever it was called)
-and serial numbers whose script and form are similar to both each other,and the Bulova Case SN's of later years.
So far, besides those listed directly above, we see: American Standard Watch Case Co; The "American standard shield"; Rubaiyat; American Standard Watch Co; and some "others" are either trademarked by Bulova or are a subsidiary thereof.

I think "Rubaiyat W Co" was probably a subsidiary of J Bulova; it's "a Bulova" of early decent, and this would fit the "only Bulova in Am Std cases".   
We just don't have the smoking gun...yet
 what are others thoughts? 

"I'm thinking:   American Standard Watch Case Co. only made cases for Bulova"  I'm thinking the same.  J. Bulova Co needed a U.S. based Case manufacturing facility for whatever reason:  To manufacture a 'superior' American Watch? - Supply/Demand? - Tax purposes?  Prior to everything needed to manufactured in Switzerland and imported.  The Rubaiyat W. Co Movement and Case would come prior to Bulova W. Co as a predessor and not a subsiduary.  According to the Providence Preservation Society the American Standard Watch Case Company was founded, here in the United States, in 1920 on Sprague St in New York. http://local.provplan.org/pps/detail.asp?UID=ASWC  I'm almost certain they did not pull this data out of thin air.  This does not entirely mean J.Bulova Co were not stamping their Cases as such (American Standard) as early as 1918 at a facility in Switzerland, casing Movements and importing the completed Watches.  If this be the case the Globe hallmark would be pre 1920, the Shield 1920 and on ?  We're close to an answer but the fact is We don't know...at least I don't.

I'm a little unsure of the Rhode Island Historic Preservation HC data.  They state

The company was bought by watch giant Bullova in 1948 (RIHPHC 1979, 1981; Woodward 1986), who still used this factory as of 1981.

...but we see in the Bulova Company Report of 1931 that American Standard Watch Co was a subsidary of Bulova Watch Company INC...which sounds like the parent corporation of all these subsidaries and companies.  Perhaps the historic society got that change in ownership wrong, or it was simply a "company name change" w/ Bulova Watch Co INC owing it all along.  This leads me to question other statements in this source.  Besides citing themselves, I'm looking for the Woodward 1986 citation.  It certainly is a another piece of the puzzle.

I'm thinking it (Am Standard) was wholly owned by Bulova. The existence of other watches in the same cases, yet using known Bulova ebauches, and the fact that Bulova still offers this service to other companies, ie. they supply movt and case, you stick your name on it, seems consistent. 

The American Standard Watch Case Company was incorporated in Providence Rhode Island prior to February 1921, at that time the logo for American Standard Watch Case Company changed to the Shield Logo. Now at this time the old American Standard Watch Case Company Started by Adolph Bulova in 1916 was located at 9 Maiden Lane in 1921. 

In February 1917, the American Standard Watch Case Company was wholly owned by Adolph Bulova and located at 22 Maiden lane. In March 1919 it is listed as being located at 2 John Street.

In case you are wondering: Adolph Bulova also owned the Rubaiyat Watch Company and the Hudson Watch Company in 1917, both are also listed as being located at 22 Maiden Lane. The address is significant as 22 Maiden Lane was the location of J. Bulova Co in 1916. In 1917 J. Bulova Co is listed as being at 2 John Street. 

My concern is seeing American Standard cased watches with a globe listed as 1922 or worse yet 1923 when the logo changed with the incorporation of the company in very early 1921 from my research. 

I know Rubaiyat Watch Company, Hudson Watch Company, and the American Standard Watch Company existed prior to February 1917 as they are listed in the 1917 business directory that was published in February 1917. My assumption is that Adolph Bulova had been building Rubaiyat, Hudson, and American Standard Cases through contracts with one of the watch case companies operating on maiden lane since at least 1915. In 1916 he formed the three companies on his own, I personally wonder if Adolph was not the drive behind what becomes the Bulova Watch Company and not Joseph Bulova. 

The list of Watch Case Companies in Manhattan, NYC in 1915.